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Latvia / Estonia illusions?

Questions and real info about visas, travel requirements, phone numbers, travel preparations, rules for meeting the family, etc...
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Green_Frog
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Latvia / Estonia illusions?

Postby Green_Frog » Wed May 21, 2008 8:58 am

I've been to Latvia and Estonia many times (for holidays and trips). To kill two birds with one stone, admittedly, also trying to find a suitable lady (without unrealistic illusions). After all, aren't all single men on the lookout?

Latvia has about 2.4 million people, Estonia about 1.4 million.

Latvia has at least 10 (perhaps more) known marriage/introduction agecnies. Estonia has... NONE ! Makes me even more suspicious of agencies.

OK, I did some research. I visited several agencies in Riga (Latvia), and all are similar. Some are more friendly and helpful, some more eager, than others- to show their male clients profiles of stunning women.

However, all became somewhat more defensive when I started asking questions, such as- "How many men have contacted this girl?", "Has that girl been on the site for long?" ..And dare I say it, but- "Are these profiles real women seeking a husband?" I also asked about parties/social events. Only one agency said that they did do this in the past, but no longer. Naturally- because the likelihood of people falling for each other and exchanging personal info in a social environment is too high, and therefore unprofitable for the agency.

To cut a long story short, not blinded by illusions (am I something of a "Russian Detective"?), it was clear that all the agencies are only interested in one thing- money. Business is business- simple as that.

Any ideas?
Love those that love you.Hate those that hate you.Life is real, live in the real world.Scam = Scum.

Latvia / Estonia illusions?

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anna
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Postby anna » Mon May 26, 2008 6:11 pm

Actually,what is the question?somehow i did not get the idea :wink:

about Latvia you also shoud know,there here are two nationality:
-originally latvian
- russian ,who probably was born in latvia but because someone from family russian -has typical russian mentality :) ( with european point of view :lol: ) but totally different from latvian ,of course....

in estonia not so many russians as in latvia ,but exists of course :wink:

in site which i mention before mostly russian from different countrys....
i know one site where are mostly russian but only from latvia or who work at the moment in london or ireland)))..(.interface-russian and latvian language .)
also some latvian site exists but there are no any english language ,only latvian interface,i could not manage with that site myself :lol: ))))

just let me know if you would like to know tham or one of tham -i send than message to you )))dont want open tham up here :D

ps i never used any agency,even if i still looking for :wink: may be not time yet in my 38 :lol: ?;-)))))))
1 sorry for my english;-)))2 lets think positive!=will be healthy forever;-))

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Postby Green_Frog » Tue May 27, 2008 9:35 am

Well, it wasn't a question really... mostly just observations :D

Estonia has a high Russian population, too. In Tallinn, it's about 50%. Narva (Estonia's third city) is 98% Russian.

There were Russians in all 3 Baltic States before the war, and no political problems. It's because pre-war Russians living there were mostly Whites who had fled the Reds. Post-War Russians were brought in by Stalin to "Sovietise" the Baltic States. The Soviets killed and forcibly deported (to Siberia) tens of thousands of locals from all three Baltic States in 1940, and then again after the war. It's why Balts (as well as other East-Europeans) dislike Russians. Sadly, Russians get the blame for this tyranny when the guilt should be directed at the communists (who, it must be remembered, killed millions of their own people (ethnic Russians) right from the beginning).

As a people, there are good and bad Russians (as with every nation)- and I've met some really nice ones. I have to admit, Russian/East European women tend to be more feminine than Western women. Sadly, we have too many feminists in the West. On the other hand, there are too many scammers from East Europe nowadays...

Well, back to the sites... Yes, please let me know about those you mention, I'd be interested in making some contacts throught them.

As for the Latvian-only site, I would also have problems :D Atvainojiet, Es nerunaju Latviski- Es esmu no anglijas. I only know a few Latvian words, and that's the longest phrase I know. No, po-russkii govorju konechno luchshe... mne interesujet evropeiski jazjki :)
Love those that love you.Hate those that hate you.Life is real, live in the real world.Scam = Scum.

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anna
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Postby anna » Tue May 27, 2008 5:07 pm

:D Done.Check your m. Good that you know history (especially with such point of view :) respect 8) )
Figurs which you mention -% of russian in Estonia looks like too high,thats not correct i think .But what ever :wink: Thats was not the main issue :D When I will find more correct figurs -i can let here know :D,if i will find time)))...any way in latvia 20-30% more russians compare with Estonia :)
1 sorry for my english;-)))2 lets think positive!=will be healthy forever;-))

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Postby Green_Frog » Tue May 27, 2008 8:39 pm

Thanks for the site, I'll check it out...

Narva in Estonia is virtually a Russian city, as are the other cities in the North-Eastern part of Estonia. Other cities/towns nearby (Narva-J?esu, Sillam?e, Kohtla J?rve, J?esu, etc...) also have large Russian majorities, but I only know the figure for Narva. The West and South of Estonia have Estonian majorities as do the islands...

Speaking of islands, did you know that Estonia has more than 1000 islands? Latvia and Lithuania have... NONE! Unbelievable, isn't it?

Back to Russians, I did read the figures somewhere, but can't recall them exactly. As far as I know, the Russian percentage in Estonia as a whole is about a third. I think it's either Latvia or Lithuania that has as many as 50% Russians... (But I know a lot more about Estonia than LV and LT...)

In London there are supposed to be many Russians- but I rarely hear Russian spoken here. And as for the rambler.ru site, there seem to be so many (single?) Russian girls in London... but there must be twice as many single Russian men, I would guess...
Love those that love you.Hate those that hate you.Life is real, live in the real world.Scam = Scum.

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Postby Manny » Wed May 28, 2008 11:19 am

We live part time in Estonia.

We are currently trying to recruit women from there but it is quite hard. The basic fact of the matter is that Estonia is now one of the most affluent countries of the FSU despite its low population so women are not too desperate to leave and shack up with a foreigner.

Furthermore, whatever credibility Brits may have had, has been shot to bits by Easyjet taking southeners to Tallinn for p!ss-ups and stag nights. If you want to meet a woman in Estonia look outside Tallinn - Tallinn women will seldom look twice at a Westerner. Lasnamae is the Russian heavy district just outside Tallinn, any women you do meet in Tallinn will be from there. Caveat Emptor!
Last edited by Manny on Mon Mar 23, 2009 12:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Green_Frog » Wed May 28, 2008 7:52 pm

You're right about those stupid stag parties. They have totally ruined not just Tallinn, but Riga, Prague, and just about every East European capital.

What are you recruiting women from Tallinn for? Are you a cosmetic company?

You're right about Lasnam?e... but the highest (percentage of Russians compared to Estonians) is in the Kopli region of Tallinn. On the other hand, the highest percentage of Estonians is in the N?mme area in the South of Tallinn.

It's true that women there are very wise up to Westerners- the novelty has long worn off. Even in the smallest towns nowadays.

By the way, what does "Caveat Emptor" mean? Sounds distinctly Latin to me...
Love those that love you.Hate those that hate you.Life is real, live in the real world.Scam = Scum.

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Postby Manny » Wed May 28, 2008 9:07 pm

Caveat Emptor is indeed Latin for "buyer beware" :P

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Postby Green_Frog » Thu May 29, 2008 8:47 am

Wise words indeed :)
Love those that love you.Hate those that hate you.Life is real, live in the real world.Scam = Scum.

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Re: Latvia / Estonia illusions?

Postby misterb » Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:40 pm

Well my brother lives in Tallinn for 10 years now and I have been there a few times too and I can say I need no agency there! Girls actually come up to me... one even tried to pay me a drink but I refused. lol

What the girls told me is that some foreigners go there and get drunk or drink a lot and they hate drinkers that is why most westerners get thumbs down, because they drink and behave like idiots. These girls want to be treated like ladies, not like whores and every man who goes to them thinks he can get laid, the serious girls spot that right away.
I had to save a girl from a drunk guy actually... lol... then she hit on me right after but I gently retired after she said "I'm looking for hot man"

It is very easy to meet Estonian girls but from my experience these girls are not stupid dolls who will say yes easilly and they can also tell if you just want to get laid or actually want something genuine. You got girls for both things anyway from what I could see.

So if you want to meet girls don't go to some random disco, try going to "Amigo", which is the disco from Viru Hotel (it is a 5 star hotel!). If you do stay at the hotel the security will ask for the ID of the girl when she is going with you to your room (if you manage to get that far but I would suspect of any girl who would do that) because some girls would rob the foreigners who stayed at the hotel, after going to their room.

Maybe you guys like one night stands a lot but for me I do like this:
Day 1.
I meet the girl, get to know her first, don't let things get too far. Making out is fine, but no sex. I mean... if I want a serious relation I don't start it in bed... I want to know the girl first no?
I arrange with the girl to meet her the following day, during the MORNING/AFTERNOON somewhere nice and public.

Day 2. If girl meets me somewhere nice and public it is a lot less likely she's not serious. Walk around go see some stores and watch how she behaves. If she asks you to buy her something or even suggests it indirectly ("oh I would REALLY like to buy this but I can't afford it") ... red flag.

Day 3. Out for dinner or just a romantic date .. get to know her deeply, talk a lot.. see how it connects.. if all feels right and you don't feel suspicious not even a bit then go for it.

If at ANY TIME you feel suspicious about her but think it is your imagination, raise red flag immediately.
Take more time to know her, tell her you'd like to meet her friends or her family, you can tell a lot by that. If she refuses and says it is too early while having told you how special you are and how she wants to go with you... well.. you know the drill. :p


As for me, I just rent an appartment in the center for €300 / month, much cheaper than Hotel and as long as you don't act stupid and carry around a stack of money and expensive stuff, am unlikely to run into problems.

I met several girls from Estonia/Lithuania and general rule is:
- If the girl is looking for sex she will make it obvious
- If the girl is looking to scam you/extort money and free holidays/gifts, she'll show a lot of premature interest and like every scammer say she's looking for a supportive man (supportive = pay her stuff)
- If the girl is decent, she will want to know you better first and will not like it if you advance early

To test a girl you can do something very simple, which I did. Ask her something like:
"Would you like to come to my country for a week to visit and have some fun?"

Answers are:
Scammer: Oh that would be perfect.
Bitchy: How about we go to my/your place now?
Serious: I am not that kind of girl. (this is what she answered)

Remember that a scammer will use emotional blackmailing while a genuine girl would never act like such.

"If you really loved me you'd do this" (being *this* something that will cost you money)
"You should do this", "You should do that" (complaining about your behavior)

Generally these girls are quite "happy" (they don't complain much about their life) so if she keeps nagging about how unhappy she is and how life was so bad to her, she's a scammer 99% of the time.

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Re: Latvia / Estonia illusions?

Postby misterb » Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:47 pm

An important thing I forgot... GENUINE girls will NEVER EVER say they don't care about the looks.
Any real woman cares about that! I don't think it is a coincidence that every woman that told me she didn't really care much about looks was either a prostitute, a striper or a scammer.

This year I will be in Estonia to spend xmas with my brother and nephiews for about 3 weeks and will have a chance of enjoying the fine quality of eastern european genuine non-slutty girls. Hopefully will meet one that suits my liking and vice-versa! :-)

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Re: Latvia / Estonia illusions?

Postby Ralph Warner » Tue Oct 26, 2010 3:12 am

Hi Misterb, we normally deal with the girls you meet online and not the ones you actually meet while you are in the FSU, that said, the information you give will still give some idea of what to expect from a genuine girl.

The important points for me in what you said are;

The young girl who is interested in a much older man and is asking for money before you have actually met is either going to be a scammer or at the very best somebody you dont want to meet.

If you are being sent nude pictures she is unlikely to be the wholesome girl you want to take home to mum and if you are a man asking for them from somebody you believe to be genuine then you need to have a think about your own approach

When (more likely "IF") you do meet her, if she wants to stay at an expensive hotel, if she hints at things for you to buy and generally wants you to put your hand in your pocket, perhaps you would be best to spend some time meeting real girls who dont expect you to spend money on them.

If you go to a bar, get drunk and make a fool of yourself, dont expect to wake up the next day with an angel beside you.
"Thou shall read thy FAQ" CLICK HERE for salvation
Has your scammer sent you to any websites, it may have been fake.

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Re: Latvia / Estonia illusions?

Postby alg » Sat Dec 11, 2010 7:46 pm

I was born in Tallinn, can trace family tree in estonia back to 14th century. I would rather celibate and/or mastrubate that go with most Tallinn girls no matter which language they speak. They remind me of London girls, insecure, cold, defensive, and put it simply manly and unwilling to be feminine. Yes most of them are beautiful looks wise however I don't not go by just looks. In south like Tartu, Pärnu, Põlva, etc girls are far more feminine and down to earth.

Russian speaking girls in Tallinn might be somewhat crude yet also they are passionate and you feel you are with women who does enjoy life somewhat.

Also been real helps :) And girls do like foreigners. Most Estonian girls in Tallinn even use many English words instead of Estonian one in daily speech. You also can get better customer service when you speak in English, crazy and true :))))

I say personally if i were to travel somewhere to meet girl I would go to China, Venezuela, USA :D

P.S Having said that my first gf was from tallinn and she is gorgeous in so many ways so go figure :)

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Re: Latvia / Estonia illusions?

Postby expatm » Wed Feb 23, 2011 9:30 pm

hello everyone,

this is a really interesting coincidence I have stumbled upon this topic, since I'm actually new in Estonia.
I can't have any special experience specifically concerning scammers in this country to share with you for now...
of course global things will apply here too such as examples you already mentioned here

this topic is a little old but I hope you're still active on it :)

so misterb, you have a very interesting post
I was wondering what do you exactly mean that it's easy to meet but they don't say yes...
you mean I will date like 10 girls in 2 weeks and then end up alone?!
by the way
I'd really want to know how and where you meet or prefer to meet girls here

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Re: Latvia / Estonia illusions?

Postby misterb » Sun Mar 06, 2011 11:21 am

Well I am STILL in Estonia, it is almost 4 months now and I will stay a few months more. ;-)

My "theory" was not wrong but it needs some adjustments as I identified several types of girls and certain tendencies to be accounted for:

Type of girls:
Russian: These girls expect guys to pay them everything (drinks, going out, etc) they are not picky and will sometimes do what you want in order to get free drinks. I met quite a few like this. Once they realize you're not paying more drinks to them, they'll make up a way to get rid of you. Usually they go out in groups of 2, 3 or 4 girls and can be extremely beautiful.

Russian/Estonian mix: These girls have the strong personality of the russian ladies and the relaxed no-worries attitude of an estonian. Their mood variates all the time between being cold and not giving a crap and being really gentle and making you feel like a prince. Generally they're looking for guys with money to travel for free, get gifts, etc.

Estonian over 25 years old: Due to the influence of Russian regime these girls are a bit more closed usually, tend to answer with inconclusive responses like "maybe" instead of "yes" or "no" and sometimes it can be hard to get to know them since they're reluctant to speak about themselves unless you ask specific questions.

Estonian below 25 years old: With little of no influence from Russian regime these girls are quite relaxed, talkative, friendly, funny and appreciate relaxed guys with a good sense of humor.

Generally Estonians: Girls expect guys to pay most things when they go out but some might pay their own. The thing is that these girls tend to imagine that because you are a foreigner you are somehow rich. Or at least they consider you rich compared to them so they want you to pay for everything.


As for my experience, I have met quite a lot of ladies but I am extremely picky with whom I actually spend my time with. I can say in 4 months I only met one single amazing girl, the rest I didn't find interesting but were OK for socializing a bit and some casual fun.


The Hunt
If you're looking for casual fun, you have about... well... 100% chance of getting it, even if you are fat and ugly, every night, at no cost or just with one or two drinks, if you know where to go.
I have observed for quite some time the interactions by staying full nights in a disco watching people come in alone and hooking up with someone, usually after some drinks but sometimes even without drinks. I've watched how they do it, how to spot the girls who are available, those who will go with just anyone, those who will go only with nicer guys, those who will need convincing and those who are completely not interested in meeting someone and are just going with their girlfriends to watch the live band and dance.
Yesterday specially there were a lot of lesbians in the place and I had quite some laughs watching guys hit on lesbians without realizing they were lesbians... then suddenly the girls just start kissing and the guy slides away realizing he ain't getting any action! LOL it was hillarious.
In this disco at around 2-3am most girls are already hooked up with some drunk foreign guy and the ones who aren't get "attacked" by multiple guys one by one in intervals of seconds so they won't even look at you if you try to talk to them, they'll just nod their heads and completely ignore you.
I once took a girl to see the live band, I left her sitting on her own for 3 minutes while I went to WC, when I came back there were 2 guys one sitting in front of her one sitting next to her while she pretended to find something in her purse to avoid the guys. Was quite funny because she is not used to it and was kinda scary for her. I did warn her once I get up it will only take seconds for guys to start hitting on her... and she told me right after I got up ... so it was. hehe


The Places

Clazz
From 22:00 you have live music but the entrance is paid usually 7 euros. If you go around 20:30 it is free entrance so you can enjoy some drinks and meet some girls. This place is usually half-full or full almost every day of the week and it is like a jazz club not a disco or bar. Here you can meet foreign ladies, russian ladies and estonian ladies.

Russian ladies usually go to get free drinks, in exchange they let guys hold them and if they really like you or are more slutty they even let guys take advantage a bit. They might invite you to go to a disco with them (you have to pay all the entrances and drinks so expect to spend quite some money), they drink usually wine bottles starting at 23 euros and enough for 4 glasses of wine.

Foreign ladies are very approachable and they might even pay YOU drinks so it is also cool if you're into older women who don't look attractive like russian or estonian.

Estonian ladies are not so approachable but some might be there to get free drinks, they are more picky usually but not always. I have seen young 18-19 year old girls getting drinks from guys with 50-65, it was so damn weird to watch that!!


Amigo (disco in Viru Hotel)
Best hunting ground, you can find foreign ladies and russian/estonian ladies looking for foreign guys to make out and have fun or even one night stands. Mostly estonian ladies which is better than russian. The girls are usually half-drunk and guys take advantage of that. I have seen crazy things in this place like 4 guys making out with one girl, at the same time. I find it a bit discusting but oh well, if you are into this kind of girls go for it! :p
You might want to go in early to meet girls before they are too drunk. Last time I went I got pulled to a table with 3 ladies, who were drinking champagne and got myself a free glass of champagne. The cutest lady was with her boyfriend and asked me my number for us to meet up and go out... but honestly I wasn't interested so I didn't give her my number. The boyfriend was a bit jealous but the thing is that these girls do this all the time so the guys have to put up with it in order to keep the lady. Estonian girls will do what they want, most of the time, you can't really control them. It is very common that women who are married or have boyfriend to end up in some disco kissing other guys. Decent girls normally don't go to discos.


Vapiano (usually good for lunch or dinner)
Good place to meet ladies, nobody is drunk so you can actually MEET someone for real. Girls rarely go alone so pay attention as they might be expecting company. They do go a lot in groups of 2-5 girls so you can try sitting up near 2 girls and start casual conversation or even let them do the talking.
The staff is quite friendly, I got to know most of them by now.


There are a few more cool places too but enough for now.

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