Psychology of a victim

[keira]

Wingman182, thank you for your care. To your question, I had those problems you mention, I hadn´t slept for a week and almost didn´t eat anything when the scam happened, but then I started to take medication, so I started to sleep and eat, first a little bit but then it was better and better. Now I take milder medication than in the beginning and sleep and eat normally, I started to lessen the medication and hopefully soon I will stop taking it, I feel good, so it´s on a good way! I feel that now I´m already able to think clearly about all what happened without anxiety.
I believe that you are right that for the scammers our good traits are weaknesses, sad but true...

[mysterylady]

Scammers don't care what happens to their victims when they get what they want. Take the advise of Wingman and get proper rest and nutrition. Do this for yourself, family and friends. I went through the same experience and decided that I was not going to let the scumbag destroy my life. No one is worth that.

[keira]

Hi mysterylady, thank you for your support! You are right! We are wiser now!

[mysterylady]

Anytime you want to unload, please feel free to contact me. The healing process takes time. For me its been two years but once in a while I have a flashback.

[keira]

I was thinking about why nobody made a movie about romance scamming so far? I read through some of the conversations with the scammer and there were so many surprising moments, twists and turning points, it was like reading a novel! I accused him of lying or interrogating him or laughing at him for a while, then he always explained it somehow why he was lying, I found his story very interesting, so there were moments I believed for a while, and this repeated many times, we quarelled a lot then reconciled, there were many moments when it seemed our conversation ends, but in the end I believed somehow that he is really the man on the pictures and we will meet. Even after I sent the money and found out that´s all just about money, there was a moment when I decided to give him one more chance to believe he (the first scammer) is innocent and only the second scammer is guilty and the first scammer might be a victim of a second scammer too (I talked to 2 scammers). But the next day I lost trust forever. But I read that there´s a woman who even went to Africa and found the scammer and now she is forced to scam too. And I belive there are many other victims who have interesting experience with the scammers, so if it was put together it would be a very interesting movie and it would educate wide audiences!

[Avalon1]

Dear Keira,
what you Write is exactly what is on my mind too. I also had so many fights and On and Olfs with my scammer, argueing with him about giving me proofs, sending pictures or let me contact his family. In the end i got some little pieces: a phone call with his son in LA, or a photoshopped pic of him at the place he faked to be stucked (Dubai). The problem is always, that you want to believe, cause they brainwashed you.
I was thinking about writing my story down and Look for a publisher. Or stick our (other victims) heads together and get our stories published in the media. There are so many people out there, who don't have a clue, that the were fished by Scammers.
I found the Books of Dana Wahr. She was a victim and became a Scambaiter. She wrote down her experiences during scambaiting etc. .... we really need more of this to get the public and governments more focused on the big problem.

[keira]

2dream4, that is exact, I believed because I wanted to believe and I wanted because I was brainwashed! Now it seems to me like losing common sense, but now it's a whole different situation than it was then. A book with real stories is needed too, but I thought about a movie which can have even a fabricated story but based on real experiences of victims. I bet that after showing it in movies first there will be many people who will say the victims were stupid, but if the amount of money sent by victims to scammers is that huge, they can't be just stupid people, and hopefully there will be some people who will understand and take this seriously. When I read how some people react, like if that could never happen to them, that they are not so "stupid", I wish them this experience, but it's just in that moment, in fact what I do is warn who I can, although many times it seems like fighting against windmills, they don't take seriously my warning. But fortunately there are people who take it seriously. I warn my friends and their friends, but it happened that I warned even someone who is a complete stranger, but that was a woman from my country and her profile looked real and I wrote the message in a way that scammers can't translate in a translator (I tested it), so that only a person who speaks well the language would understand. I don't know if it wasn't a mistake, but I felt sorry for that woman, she looked kind on pictures and Timeline, has somebody any experience with warning people?

[Avalon1]

Well, i was warnend by a stranger in FB that i was is in contact of a reported scammer. It was too late for me, cause i had sent money months before. I am thankful though, that i was warned1. It was the First Time that i Heard- about Romance scammers. I learned alot during the following weeks, informing myself. I found this Site here and also scambaiter Deutschland.
The problem is that warning others can mean warning other scammers.
I got contacted by others via facebook, who asked me for the profiles i had reported, and i must admit, that i did feel unconfortable warning them, but i did in the end. Maybe that was wrong, i don't know.

Maybe one of the moderators/baiters can comment on this.

[Pinky]

I have written a book, probably 10 times over. I've currently got 2 versions partially written on my computer desk top. I've never been a victim but was a long time scam baiter and even a moderator here for many years. I've counseled hundreds of victims and don't think there's anything in the world of romance scam that I haven't heard of.

My favorite book subject that is currently half written is about a couple of my baits - the ones where I completely fooled the scammers, turning the tables on them. But in the end, though they were outrageously funny, they were horribly mean and I just can't being myself to admit to the world, the wicked things I did - even though i don't feel what I did was as cruel as a real scam. I think I was wrong to be judge and jury and dole out punishment.

[Avalon1]

Thanks for that Pinky, so ist is maybe your own book, your favorit one, that is perfect to get published or become a Script to make a movie about a real scammer-baiter story.

Maybe publishing those Stories from Time to Time could be one way To push this theme more into the focus of the Public and also the authorities AND it could maybe help collecting some Money to help some of the victims which are financially ruined by a scam.

[keira]

Pinky, I´d like to read your book about baiting, that must be interesting! 2dream4, that´s good to hear that sometimes it´s useful to warn even a stranger. However the woman I warned does not react and still has the scammer in her friends list, she didn´t even read my message. I didn´t add her to my friends and I wrote her a message from a fake profile, I didn´t want to be connected with this by my real profile, I don´t know what connection she already has with the scammer. Although her profile looks real, we can never know who reads the message, that´s why I wrote it in a special way that scammers can´t translate with translator, and I didn´t write the name of the scammer to the message, but I described it. Maybe more useful would be to contact her from a realistic looking profile and ask for friendship? I don´t know, but somehow I don´t have good feeling from this, I don´t want to be involved in this very much, I don´t want to draw the scammers´ attention, I don´t know what relationship she already has with the scammer, I think I did enough already. Or have somebody an experience what is the best way to warn others?

[keira]

So far I cursed myself that I sent the money, but now I came to an idea that it´s good, at least I found out he was a scammer very soon. If I didn´t send, maybe he would try another tactics, maybe he would play that he saved his money and I would believe him and then I would really fall in love with him and because of that a big damage would be made in my real relationships. And then he would try something else how to get me into trouble, and in the end I would either send money, because I wouldn´t know about romance scamming. It´s good that it was just this short and I learnt a lot about many kinds of scamming, although it was an expensive lesson.

[keira]

Talking about movies, I have seen a movie, which – although it was about something entirely different – reminded me about how the psychology of internet romance scamming works. It´s title is „The best offer“, it´s an Italian movie, it´s original title is „La migliore offerta“. In the beginning I had the same feelings like at the internet romance scam, it was about a main character and his problematic customer whose behaviour is very annoying for the main character, but he helped her because she was begging him and convinced him that only he could help her. It seemed that the main character had full control over the situation, mostly because of the business character of their relationship, he could leave and refuse the cooperation, but as he was a good hearted person, he gave the customer chance and decided to help her. I hope my post will not be considered as off-topic, because it was very well described, how a person – if having at least a little compassion – have NO OTHER CHOICE than helping, maybe this would be understandable even to those who doesn´t understand the victims of romance scams, those who say the victim could leave, it´s shown here that he couldn´t leave, especially when there were already emotions involved. There were many other common signs with the internet romance scam, like the identity and story and the matter of business of the customer was covered with mystery, the baits she provided were aimed directly to the personality and interests of the main character, so he became intrigued. I perceived the movie as a metaphorical and artistic expression of internet romance scam and I strongly recommend it to all artistic romance scammed souls! It seems that this kind of manipulation with emotions is well known and can be applied in many areas. Maybe there are people who want to see the movie so I will not write more and don´t tell if the movie is really about scamming or the point is something else or if the customer was bad or good, what I described was only the beginning of the movie which raised the same emotions in me as the romance scam but tells nothing about how the movie will continue.
It´s interesting how everything reminds me now about romance scam, but I have seen another movie recently „Our idiot brother“ and I feel the same „idiot“ as the man who sold weed to a policeman in uniform because he was manipulated to believe that he has a hard period of life and as he was good hearted he felt pity for him. He got into trouble because he was a puppet in the manipulation of others, he always accomodated people who manipulated him at that very moment, but I liked when there was a moment in the movie when he resisted and stayed on the right side! I know that it´s just a movie but it was like giving me hope that I will resist once too and stay on the right side.
The thing I can´t forgive the scammers is the threatening and the sleepless nights and mental damage they caused to me and other victims, how they can be that bad to somebody who helped them and gave them money even if doesn´t have enough for himself (herself). Every time I fall asleep I have dreams which are somehow connected with the scam, it´s quite crazy because it´s already many weeks now and it doesn´t matter if it´s through the day or at night, always!

[Pinky]

Thanks for the heads up on the movies. I'll look for them.

And try not to measure the time when it comes to healing. Everyone is different. You're doing all the right things. It will come.

[Wingman182]

Hello keira first off don't worry about anything being off topic right now. For you at this point in your healing everything is on topic. But if you do post something that does not belong someone from the staff here will let you know. However as far as I am concerned this is your thread. And I would like you to think of this thread as your safe place to come and write what ever you feel the need to. And in the end you may fine the therapeutic value in just the act of writing your thoughts and feelings down just as many of us have. So as long as what you write will not be seen as offensive in anyway, write away my friend.
And inspiration from movies can manifest itself in many different ways, and not just about the scam part. Take my name here and the script after my signature at the bottom. Both are the direct results from inspiration risen from movies.
Wingman just means the friend that will do what he can to help when he can. (We do have personal lives to live as well.) But the 182 part comes from the movie “TURK 182”. It's about an off duty fire fighter who was alerted about a little girl that was trapped inside a burning building while he was at a bar. So the fire fighter went into the burning building with no regard to his own personal safety like all fire fighters do and he saved the little girls life. Unfortunately he was badly injured in the process. Now instead of being hailed as a hero for saving the little girl the city officials had turned their back on him because he had been drinking. He lost his job and his medical insurance. Even the mayor said out right that he did not have time to waist on a drunk.
Well the fire fighter had a younger brother who was not about to sit still for this and went on a one man campaign to show not only to the mayor, but to the entire city that his older brother mattered.
So the inspiration here is that for me 182 means that you, me, and all of us. Victims and survivors alike.
We matter !!!
And as for “Pay It Forward”. In short it's about a movie by the same name who's premise is about making the world a better place to live. One person helps three people who badly need it. And in return those three people help three more each. Then they do the same and so on. If the chain is not broken this pyramid effect of good will would one day make the entire world a better place to live. Okay enough said about the movies.
Well maybe one more reference,,, One of yours.

keira

It´s interesting how everything reminds me now about romance scam, but I have seen another movie recently „Our idiot brother“ and I feel the same „idiot“

Of course most everything around you is going to remind you of the scam. You had been deeply hurt, worse you had been tricked into believing that this someone was a real person. Now you are facing the truth of it all. The person was never real. They never had any feeling for you what so ever. And no it dose not bother them in the slightest bit that they take advantage of good hearted people just to steal from them. And they could care less about the lives they destroy along the way as long as the money keeps flowing in. I don't know about you, but this sounds to me like a person without a soul. The last thing it sounds like is that you are an idiot. Your not and please don't think like that. You are where we either are or were. In a very dark place, but you have helping hands here to guide you toward the light at the end of the tunnel.
And I agree with Pinky. It sounds like you have put yourself on a clock when it comes to the progress of your healing. Again please don't do this. We all heal in our own way and in our own time. And there is no schedule. No set time limit. It simply takes the time it takes regardless if it's long or short.
Remember you are working through a massive psychological and emotional trauma. Be kind to yourself. And just give yourself what ever amount of time you need.

Don't feel bad about the bad dreams either. During my dark time I had trouble with reoccurring nightmares. I won't bother you with the details, but things were so bad when I woke up from them I would find my dog under my bed. Yes the same one as my avatar. A big Alaskan Malamute like him under my bed. I ended up having to see a good therapist to get over them. And you never have to feel ashamed about needing to ask for that type of help. Some things we just can't work out for ourselves.
But it is rare to see someone write about their dreams. After all it is a scary subject when you think about it. But this show me something new about you keira. You have strength and courage you are not giving yourself credit for.
Once you start to believe in yourself and come to love yourself again. You will see this strength and courage you have with your own eyes.
Just never loss hope. And if you ever need to talk. We are always here to listen.